印度网友:为啥解放军这么弱?他们有多缺实战经验(图)

以中国目前的发展速度来看,在经济上超越其他国家已经成为了事实,而军事实力方面,虽然中国在武器方面还没有美国那么的先进,但是中国的防御类以及远程类武器上的成绩有目共睹,这也是为何美国只会威慑来与中国打交道的主要原因。但在美版知乎Quora上,印度网友提问道:中国军队很弱吗?他们有多缺少实战训练?这个问题引起各国专家和网友的热议,我们来看看他们的观点。

问题:为什么中国的军事力量如此之弱?

问题:为什么中国部队没怎么经历过实战训练却被认为十分强大?

美国专家戴维•罗舍的回答

If I play chess with a five-year-old child, no matter how many times I beat the child in chess, do you think I can be called a master? The same logic also applies to war. If a military power is bombing insurgents, and the other party's most advanced weapons are Toyota pickup trucks and several machine guns, and the so-called fortress is only several old houses, will you call it war when the military throws decapitation missiles on the mud shed?

如果我和一个五岁的孩子下棋,不管我在国际象棋中打败这个孩子多少次,你认为我可以被称作一个大师吗?同样的逻辑也适用于战争,如果一个军事强国在轰炸叛乱分子,而对方最先进的武器只是丰田皮卡车和几挺机枪,所谓的堡垒只是几栋旧房子,当军方把斩首导弹扔到泥棚上时,你会称之为战争吗?

Therefore, these two issues are actually quite laymen and somewhat narrow.

因此,这两个问题其实挺外行而且有些狭隘的。

Since the Second World War, the U.S. Navy and air force have never fought against close opponents. The U.S. military has only two departments, the army and the Marine Corps, which have so-called combat experience. Even such experience is obtained in a high degree of comparative advantage.

自第二次世界大战以来,美国海军和空军从未与势均力敌的对手对抗过,美国军方只有陆军和海军陆战队两个部门有过所谓战斗经验,即使是这样的经验,也是在高度的优势对比中获得的。

For example, American infantry rarely attack well defended fortifications. They will call an F-16 to drop some JDAM bombs, and the problem is solved. When the air raid you call may not be able to carry out, it means that you are fighting with your peers, and China is one of the few peers for the United States.

例如,美国步兵很少去攻击防御良好的防御工事,他们会呼叫一架F-16来投放一些JDAM炸弹,问题就解决了。当美军呼叫的空袭可能无法进行时,这意味着你正在与同级竞争对手作战,而中国对美国来说,就是为数不多的同级对手。

Therefore, in order to deal with competitors at the same level, comprehensive and systematic exercise is more important than low-intensity combat.

因此,为应对同级竞争对手,全面、系统的锻炼比低强度的战斗更重要。

China's ground forces have a series of "leapfrog" military exercises every year, in which two or more brigades confront each other. The blue army is the "enemy", playing the role of a sharpener, and the Red Army is the people's Liberation Army.

中国地面部队每年都有“跨越”系列军事演习,其中两个或更多的旅相互对峙,蓝军为“敌军”,扮演磨刀石的角色,“红军”为解放军。

If the PLA adopts all-round simulation of actual combat, it must adopt the simulation system closest to actual combat. The whole army has popularized the laser simulation engagement system long ago. Unfortunately, due to the technical level, the laser simulation engagement system has been limited to individual weapons.

解放军采用全方面模拟实战,那肯定要采用最接近实战的模拟系统。很早以前全军就已经普及了激光仿真交战系统,可惜受限于技术水平,激光仿真交战系统一直只限于单兵武器。

With the progress of technology, the laser simulation of Los weapons is not only limited to individual soldiers. After being hit and destroyed, tanks, aircraft, artillery and other equipment will also lock the fire control system and cannot shoot.

随着技术的进步,直瞄武器的激光仿真不单单只局限于单兵,坦克、飞机、火炮等装备在被击中摧毁之后也会锁闭火控系统,无法射击。

The weapon system requiring indirect targeting is automatically judged according to the force deployment and configuration of both sides in big data to simulate the battle damage.

而需要间接瞄准的武器系统,则通过在大数据中的自动根据双方兵力部署及配置情况进行判定,模拟生成战损情况。

Everything in Zhu rihe is for actual combat. Only when the training is infinitely close to the actual combat, can we give full play to the maximum training results in the actual combat.

在朱日和的一切,都是为了实战。只有在训练中无限接近实战,才能在实战中发挥最大的训练成果。

This is the famous "NATO force" type 59 M1A2 tank. It simulates the enemy. Do you see the laser transmitter on the gun? It also has receivers on its shell and turret. The system is set up so that the Redford (Chinese tank) of Type 99 tank must hit it twice in front before it can be counted as destroyed.

这是着名的“北约部队”的“59型M1A2”坦克,它模拟的是敌方主战坦克,看到枪上的激光发射器了吗?它的外壳和炮塔上也有接收器。该系统的设置使得99型坦克的雷德福(中国坦克)必须在前方击中它两次,才能算作被摧毁。

The venue of the annual "crossing series" exercise is located in the famous Zhurihe training base, from which we can see the strong combat strength of the people's Liberation Army.

一年一度的“跨越系列”演习的场地,就坐落在着名的朱日河训练基地,从中我们可以透视解放军强大的战斗力量。

德国专家兰斯•钱伯斯的回答

Tank to tank, aircraft to aircraft, submarine to submarine, aircraft carrier to aircraft carrier, China lags behind us to a large extent. It is not surprising that China has entered the modernization of military hardware and personnel development late.

坦克对坦克,飞机对飞机,潜艇对潜艇,航空母舰对航空母舰,中国在很大程度上落后于我们,鉴于中国进入军事硬件和人员发展现代化时间较晚,这并不奇怪。

However, China is now at a stage where its "imaginary enemy" needs to think twice before attacking her. Her arsenal of Supersonic Missiles, "carrier killer" missiles, anti satellite missiles and energy weapons will cause heavy casualties no matter who dares to attack her.

然而,中国现在正处于这样一个阶段,它的“假想敌人”在攻击她之前需要三思而后行。她拥有的超音速导弹、“航母杀手”导弹、反卫星导弹、能源武器等武器库,无论谁胆敢攻击她,都会造成重大伤亡。

The reason why it is called an "imaginary enemy" is that China never wants to be an enemy with anyone, especially with the country with the strongest military strength in the world. China's army is only for defense, so no western country or Japan dares to put opium into the throat of the Chinese people again as before!

之所以说是“假想的敌人”,是因为中国从来不想与任何人为敌,尤其是与世界上军事实力最强的国家为敌,中国的军队只是为了防御,所以没有西方国家或日本敢像以前那样,再次把鸦片塞进中国人民的喉咙里!

China has about 300 nuclear weapons for deterrence, while the United States has 7300. Therefore, the defensive nature of the Chinese army is obvious.

中国拥有大约300枚用于威慑的核武器,而美国拥有7300枚,因此,中国军队的防御性质是显而易见的。

China has no intention of dominating the fate of other countries, nor does she want to be slaughtered. Therefore, she has frequently put forward the concept of "sovereign equality of all countries" in the United Nations.

中国无意主宰其他国家的命运,她也不想任人宰割,因此她在联合国频频提出“各国主权平等”的理念。

On the other hand, we in the United States want to dominate everyone. According to the article of the worldwide network of US military base, "the United States has established control over the governments of 180 United Nations Member States", while the United Nations has only 193 member states.

另一方面,我们美国想要主宰所有人。根据《美国军事基地全球网络》(the Worldwide Network of US Military Base)一文,“美国已经建立了对180个联合国成员国政府的控制”,而联合国只有193个成员国。

The United States spends 93% of its time in war. In its 200 year history, there is only 12 years without war! It will even launch war under false premise, such as the so-called "anti-terrorism". In this process, with the continuous emergence of new enemies, it can always ensure that defense contractors can make profits for a long time in the future.

美国93%的时间都在战争中,在其200年历史中,只有12年没有战争!它甚至会在虚假的前提下发动战争,比如所谓的“反恐”。在这个过程中,随着新敌人的不断产生,它总是能确保国防承包商在未来很长一段时间内都能盈利。

Now, the United States, which has 7300 nuclear weapons, calls North Korea, which has about six nuclear weapons, a "threat". How much threat can North Korea bring us? Are you going to find an excuse to start a war again?

现在,拥有7300枚核武器的美国,却将拥有大约6枚核武器的朝鲜称为“威胁”,朝鲜能给我们带来多大的威胁?是不是又要寻找借口发动战争?

In contrast, Israel has about 80 nuclear weapons, but we turn a blind eye to it. Can you imagine what the United States would do if any Arab country wanted to possess nuclear weapons?

相比之下,以色列拥有约80枚核武器,我们却对此视而不见。你能想象如果任何一个阿拉伯国家想要拥有核武器,美国会怎么做吗?

The concept of equal treatment of others has never existed in American history.

平等对待他人的概念在美国历史上从未存在过。

From the beginning, the United States believed that it was superior to other countries. Starting from its "destiny" theory, it claimed that it was superior to the Native Americans and defended their killing and occupation of Indian land. Then there is the "Monroe Doctrine", which turns South America into its own backyard. Today, its concept of superiority has evolved into "the exception of missionary duty" - basically, if you don't agree with my intervention, I have the right to kill you!

从一开始,美国就认为自己比其他国家优越,它从它的“天命”学说开始,声称自己比北美原住民优越,为他们的杀戮和占领印第安人的土地辩护。然后是“门罗主义”,将南美洲变成自己的后院,今天,它的优越感概念已经演变成“传教士义务的例外论”——基本上,如果你不同意我的介入,我就有权杀了你!

The world will not be peaceful unless the United States gives up its "I'm better than you" mentality. Unfortunately, even American citizens will not live a peaceful life until then, because its huge wealth has been wasted on the military industrial complex warned by Eisenhower.

除非美国放弃“我比你强”的心态,否则世界不会安宁。遗憾的是,在此之前,即使是美国公民也不会过上平静的生活,因为它的巨额财富被浪费在了艾森豪威尔曾警告过的军工综合体上。

Until then, China will and should continue to improve its military strength until it is stronger than that of the United States. She is absolutely capable of doing this!!

在那之前,中国将而且应该继续改善其军事实力,直到它比美国的军事实力更强,她绝对有能力做到这一点!!

When the United States tried to cut off China's cooperation in space projects, she developed her own space projects and was about to use local technology to build her own space station. Obama tried to cut off the sale of computer chips to China. She not only has the world's fastest supercomputer, but also has just launched the world's first quantum computer, which is more than 20000 times faster than her peers.

当美国试图切断中国在太空项目上的合作时,她开发了自己的太空项目,并即将使用本土技术建立自己的空间站。奥巴马试图切断对中国的计算机芯片销售,她现在不仅拥有了世界上最快的超级计算机,而且刚刚推出了世界上第一台量子计算机,其速度是同行的2万多倍。

China's latest military toy is this low-cost anti-ship and water skimming UAV missile combination. China is building a sea skimming anti-ship UAV. These weapons can easily stop an American airline worth billions of dollars!

中国最新的军用玩具是一种低成本的反舰、掠水无人机导弹组合,中国正在建造一种掠海反舰无人机,这些武器可以轻易地让一家价值数十亿美元的美国航空公司停止运营!

华裔网友陈玉持的回答

I would like to focus on the military level. There is a characteristic of the Chinese army, which the Chinese call "fear of lack of firepower".

我想重点谈谈军事层面,中国军队有一个特点,中国人称之为“火力缺乏恐惧症”。

During World War II, there was a huge gap in military equipment between China and Japan. The Japanese used to have a small tank, but it was not advanced by the standards of European countries. Even if its armor was so thin, the type 94 ultra light tank was still a nightmare for the Chinese army in the 1930s.

二战期间,中日军事装备差距巨大。日本人过去有一种小坦克,但在欧洲各国的标准下,它算不上先进,即使它的装甲如此之薄,94型超轻型坦克在20世纪30年代仍然是中国军队的噩梦。

In fact, many Chinese soldiers didn't even have rifles at that time. In major battles, each soldier has a rifle, 100-200 bullets and 2-3 grenades. As for the guerrillas fighting in the war zone occupied by the Japanese army, half of them did not even have rifles or pistols. In each battle, the standard equipment was five bullets, and others had to use knives and spears.

事实上,当时很多中国士兵甚至连步枪都没有。在重大战斗中,每个士兵都有一支步枪、100~200发子弹和2~3枚手榴弹。至于在日军占领的战区作战的游击队,他们中有一半甚至没有步枪或手枪,每场战斗,标准装备为5发子弹,其他人不得不使用大刀和长矛。

This is what the Eighth Route Army looks like. Its main combat department doesn't even have decent armored vehicles.

这就是八路军的样子,其主要作战部门,连像样的装甲车都没有。

After eight years of all-out war and five years of civil war with Japan, the Korean War broke out when the Chinese believed that China could finally live a stable life. This time, the situation was even worse, because the PLA had to confront the most powerful military force, much stronger than Japan and the Kuomintang, but he survived, tied with the United Nations and achieved his strategic goal.

在与日本进行了8年的全面战争和5年的内战之后,当中国人认为中国终于可以过上安稳日子时,朝鲜战争爆发了。而这一次情况更糟,因为解放军不得不对抗最强大的军事力量,比日本和国民党要强得多,但他还是挺了过来,和联合国军打了平手,达成了自己的战略目的。

The people's Republic of China was founded on October 1, 1949. During the ceremony, a military parade was arranged. There were 119 artillery, 152 tanks and armored vehicles, 222 cars, 2344 horses and 17 aircraft. They were manufactured by 98 different factories from 24 countries. At that time, China was unable to produce any weapons above medium level, let alone advanced weapons. All 17 aircraft must fly over Tiananmen Square twice to ensure that the performance time of the air force part does not look too short.

中华人民共和国成立于1949年10月1日。仪式期间安排了阅兵仪式,共有119门大炮、152辆坦克和装甲车、222辆汽车、2344匹马和17架飞机,它们由来自24个国家的98家不同工厂制造,当时的中国没有能力生产任何中等以上的武器,更不用说先进武器了。所有17架飞机都必须飞越天安门广场两次,以确保空军部分的表演时间看起来不太短。

Later, the Korean civil war broke out. With the support of the United States, Lee Seung Wan's regime continued to advance to the north and close to the Yalu River. Northeast China was the only industrial zone. China could not afford the consequences of close combat with the U.S. Artillery Force at home, and even the threat was not enough, so the battle began.

后来,朝鲜内战爆发,李承晚政权在美国的支持下持续向北方推进,直逼鸭绿江,中国东北是唯一的工业区,中国负担不起与美国炮兵力量在本土短兵相接的后果,甚至连威胁都不行,所以战斗打响了。

Comparison of ammunition consumption between the two countries: 2.86 billion bullets in the United States and 1.745.3 billion bullets in China, which makes the comparison of equipment gap between the two armies more intuitive.

两国弹药消耗对比:美国,28.6亿发子弹,中国:17.453亿发子弹,这让两军之间的装备差距对比更加直观。

美国空军

This is a US military deployment

这是美国的军事部署

志愿军

This was China's military deployment, and the army was the most powerful part of the people's Liberation Army at that time.

这是中国的军事部署,陆军是当时解放军最强大的部分。

During the Korean War, the PLA greatly admired the firepower and supply capability of the US military. Since the Korean War, the Chinese people's Liberation Army believes that the era of relying on hand to hand combat and manpower has passed. They want to do everything possible to become a first-class modern military power like the US Army. Then they finally realized that these weapons represent their development process:

在朝鲜战争中志愿军对美军的火力和补给能力非常钦佩,自朝鲜战争以来,中国人民解放军认为靠肉搏拼人力的时代已经过去,他们想要尽一切可能成为美国军队那样一流的现代化军事强国,然后终于实现了,这些武器代表着他们的发展历程:

Lg-5 sniper grenade launcher is suitable for shooting the whole room at a long distance. Its accuracy is enough to shoot at the target from 1000 meters away.

LG-5狙击榴弹发射器,适合远距离一枪扫射整个房间,它的精确度足以从1000米外射向目标。

A-300 rocket, one of the best artillery rocket systems in the world, has a maximum range of 290 kilometers and a target deviation radius of 30 ~ 40 meters.

A-300火箭炮,世界上最好的炮兵火箭系统之一,最大射程290公里,目标偏离半径30~40米。

Plz-05 155mm self-propelled gun, with more advanced automatic loader, is expected to increase the number of bullets carried by a single vehicle to more than 50, and the range of launching gliding shells can reach 100 kilometers.

PLZ-05 155毫米自行火炮,使用更先进的自动装弹机,单车载弹数可望增至50发以上,发射滑翔炮弹射程可达100公里。

Type 055 destroyer, with a maximum tonnage of 13000 tons and 112 vertical launch units, is the same as Arleigh Burke flight III.

055型驱逐舰,最大吨位13000吨,垂直发射单元112个,与Arleigh Burke Flight III相同。

HQ-9 long-range air defense missile is used to intercept air attack targets at different flight altitudes, including conventional combat aircraft, stealth aircraft, armed helicopters, cruise missiles, air to ground missiles, etc. at the same time, it has the ability to intercept tactical ballistic surface to surface missiles (TBM).

HQ-9远程防空导弹,用于拦截不同飞行高度的空袭目标,包括常规作战飞机、隐身飞机、武装直升机、巡航导弹、空地导弹等,同时具备对战术弹道式地地导弹(TBM)的拦截能力。

Dongfeng-41 intercontinental missile, with a range of 14000 kilometers, is the most important strategic killer.

东风-41洲际导弹,射程达一万四千公里,是最重要的战略大杀器。

Df-21d medium range ballistic missile was developed as an aircraft carrier killer in the 1990s and 21st century to make up for the lack of air defense force.

DF-21D中程弹道导弹,在90年代和21世纪,它被开发为一种航空母舰杀手,以弥补防空力量的不足。

J20 stealth jet fighter is the only fifth generation fighter, and the other is F-22 fighter.

J20隐形喷气式战斗机,现有唯二的第五代战斗机,另一架是F-22战斗机。

In terms of the army, the armored force and Artillery Force of the Chinese people's Liberation Army have been greatly strengthened. From 2000 to 2021, the number of tanks has increased from about 7000 to 8000; The number of infantry combat vehicles increased from about 500 to more than 2100; The number of armoured personnel carriers increased from more than 1500 to 3350; Other personnel carriers and armored vehicles increased from about 10000 to 27700.

陆军方面,中国人民解放军的装甲部队和炮兵力量大大增强,从数量上来看,2000年到2021年,坦克的数量从约7000辆提升到了8000辆;步战车从约500辆增加到2100多辆;装甲运兵车从1500多辆增加到3350辆;其他运兵车和装甲车从1万辆左右增加到2.77万辆。

Aircraft carriers have grown from nothing. At present, China has two conventional powered aircraft carriers with a displacement of about 65000 tons. At the same time, one "003 aircraft carrier" is about to be launched, and the number of destroyers, frigates, submarines and other equipment has increased sharply.

航空母舰从无到有。目前中国已经拥有了两艘常规动力航母,单艘排水量6.5万吨左右,同时还有1艘“003航母”即将下水,驱逐舰、护卫舰、潜艇等装备数量急剧增加。

China needs an army strong enough to think twice about any possible threat. The weapons I show are only partially published to the public, but no one knows how many sophisticated weapons the PLA has hidden. Do you still think China's military strength is weak?

中国需要一支足够强大的军队,使任何可能的威胁都三思而后行,我展示的武器只是部分公布于大众的,可没人知道解放军到底藏了多少尖端武器。现在你还觉得中国军力弱吗?

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